- Stop using crappy hosting
- Write your copy in the first person
- Get up a resource guide squeeze page
- Don’t squander the Thank You pages that people go to after they opt-in. Use that as valuable real estate
- Repurpose your best videos and add them to your Autoresponder sequence. Put them in the order of how well they sell for you
- Use two-step opt-in boxes anywhere you possibly can for your webinar registration pages (and do webinars)
- Use magic buy buttons on your sales pages (and opt-in pages)
- Optimize your 404 pages
- Use a welcome gate if you can so that there is a picture or diagram where I recommend you put in your webinar
At this point in time I can do Q&A and does anyone have any questions?
Dan: Two questions, the first one was you said that, you’d have an email course and after six steps, six videos you’d stop. Should you literally stop emailing completely?
Clay: No, it just goes on to broadcast at that point. So once the autoresponder is going on, like when the autoresponder sequence is happening? We’re doing everything we normally do as a company when we email people. We’re still emailing people about new plug post that are coming out. We’re still emailing people about webinars that are happening.
When people know when that course ends, you can do everything else what you normally do in your business and when that’s over with, you’re still emailing broadcasts in sort of like, relevant, timely content about stuff that just happened that week so you don’t, like nothing changes while this follow up sequence is happening.
Dan: Sure, another question was that you said every three days, is that something you’ve tested? Is there a specific reason why it’s three, not two or four or five?
Clay: Yeah, so this is one of these things that’s really difficult to split test but sort of like anecdotally, we tried everyday and it was a little bit too much. People were ignoring the content, it wasn’t that they were opting out, it was that, they just weren’t consuming the content at the rate that I would like them to. We tried every other day and it became very predictable.
Every three days seems to be frequent enough that people would stay along with the course but not so often that people opted out. So it worked for us and I know there are a lot of people who are doing paid media buys or pay-per-click traffic and it’s important for them to get an ROI as soon as possible.
Like they paid $4 to get someone on their list and then they need to get their $4 out as soon as possible and we sort of have like a very, very, very long term approach so we don’t need to do that, it was just sort of the sweet spot for us. Frankly, I don’t know how to test that but it works really well for us and we’ve tried 1, 2, 3 and 4 and 3 worked the best.
Dan: Cool. Thanks for that.
Clay: Yeah absolutely.
Sam C: Hey Clay, how are you doing?
Clay: Good, how are you?
Sam C: Good. I have 3 accounts and about to buy 2 more for clients. I don’t want them to see my sources but anyway. I have a couple of questions. The resource guide really kind of struck me. I’ve been hearing you say it but now I think it finally sunk in. Do you have a LeadPage template that you’d recommend for that?
Clay: For the resource guide itself or for…
Sam C: For resource guides so that would be a thank you page after the optin right?
Clay: So we email them a PDF. It’s not the Thank You page, we send them an email with the PDF. There’s no template that we use. I mean you can just type it up in Word and save it as a PDF.
We’ve got a full-time in-house designer so they do that but you know, you could probably go on like Fiverr and find someone to do a halfway decent job but at that point they just want to know what the resources are and how pretty it looks is kind of irrelevant. We don’t even have a picture of the guide on our opt-in page right? So people kind of just want to know what the stuff is.
Sam C: OK, so you email them the resources.
Clay: We email them a link to the PDF because we want to make sure that we have a legit email address.
Sam C: Ok, I understand. Then the other question I had, welcome gate – if you recommend only having WordPress as your blog, does it still work for the rest of your site? Because that’s what I’ve been struggling with.
Clay: No, the welcome gate will only work with WordPress. It’s one of those things where it’s not something that we can program without WordPress but you could recreate it. If you hit us up, if you hit up our support we’ll give you some codes you can turn… I don’t want to say that in public too much.
I will create a blog post where we release some code that allows everyone to do it ‘cause I don’t want my support desk to get slammed but you can do it on any site. It’s just with WordPress we have a consistent way to do that.
Sam C: OK, so any developer, a skilled one, could take it and… OK, understood. Thanks.
Clay: Yeah absolutely.
John: John Burns. How are you?
Clay: Good, how are you John?
John: You are now a legend.
Clay: Ah, Thank you.
John: How much does it cost to buy Leadpages?
Clay: It’s $37 a month or $197 for a year.
John: I think I might have already bought it because I’d like to buy every.. The hosting company that you’re talking about that does everything a lot quicker, does it have a hosting where you buy then you sell on hosting and have a cPanel?
Clay: Oh, are you talking about Google AppEngine?
John: No, not Google App, the other one you were mentioning about.
Clay: Oh like Storm on Demand?
John: It’s Storm and Demand, yeah.
Clay: I believe it’scPanel or something. I haven’t logged into it in my life.
John: So does it give you the opportunity to resell hosting?
Clay: I’m sure they have a reseller program, they probably do.
John: Thank you, Clay.
Clay: Yeah, absolutely.
Andrew: Hi Clay, Andrew Poto. I have a question about the welcome gate. One of the reasons why I sort of hesitated to sign up was because I currently use PopUp Domination and a lot of my traffic comes through the blog posts that I share on Facebook and email through various lists and stuff like that, so I want a way to capture traffic on those individual pages.
What are you recommending for those individual pages if welcome gate is just showing up on the main page?
Clay: Sidebar opt-ins are good. Here’s what I recommend: a lot of people have opt-in boxes on the sidebar of their blog and we actually took that away and replaced it with a banner and when people click on that banner, they go to a landing page. So when someone sees an opt-in box on the right hand side of the blog, at some point everyone just becomes immune to that.
There’s an opt-in box there but if they see a banner with something compelling on it that is clearly from you, it’s not like a paid advertisement and they click on it, it brings them to an entire page where they’re forced to make one decision or another, you’re going to get a much higher opt-in rate.
But what we did was we took the opt-in box, we moved it to the bottom, we replaced that with a banner on our sidebar that sends people to a landing page.
The reason why I don’t like pop-ups is because it was hurting our SEO. So here’s something that I’d like everyone here to think about. Everyone is so obsessed about conversion rate. I don’t care about conversion rate. I care about raw number of opt-ins. Ok?
And I found that when I had a pop-up on my website, fewer people linked to me, the media was less likely to talk about me, people saw my business in a certain light, I got fewer social media shares, etc. When that pop-up went away, I received a lot more just sort of love from the blogosphere, a lot more links, a lot more social media shares, because people knew that they were sending their sites, and linking to a site that didn’t have a pop-up.
So even though, when that pop-up went away, my conversion rate went down, as a percentage of total traffic, the number of opt-ins went up, because I was getting more traffic from Google because I was getting more links and I had more traffic coming from inbound refers.
So you could be like a total douchebag and cram the hell out of the people with the pop-up and the sidebar and the thing on the side and all these doohickeys, and have 10, 20 different ways and get a 30% opt-in rate, but then your traffic just shrunk in half. You know what I mean, because it’s just unpleasant to people.
So I like to optimize around, sort out like the raw number of opt-ins, rather than the straight conversion rate. So that’s the number that I look at, it’s just the raw number of opt-ins. I do look at conversion rates when I’m looking at paid media buys and split testing and stuff like that. But in these situations, I personally am not a fan of pop-ups anymore. I don’t like how it positions me and my business in the industry.
I bet if you were like in the crochet niche or something like that then it would probably be fine because they’re like not completely immune to it, but at some point, you know, it just becomes like this big, huge, opt-in arms race. And it’s better off to just be like really cool with people, don’t pummel them, you know.
Andrew: Great, thank you Clay.
Clay: Yeah, absolutely.
Samuel: Hey, Clay. Samuel Junghenn.
Clay: Nice meeting you.
Samuel: First, I think you should go back to school, because it’s like 40 gold nuggets (of wisdom). And for the people in the audience that don’t realize, it’s probably like 10 times worth the ticket price just in that there.
Clay: I hope so, thank you.
Samuel: My question is more around some paid traffic sources. Obviously Google hates squeeze pages and that sort of stuff. If you’re running re-targeting campaigns, specifically, I mean just as an example, what are some tips on getting high conversions but still complying with the gods that be?
Samuel: Oh, you just put up one thing and when they approve it, you swap it out, just kidding. I’m just kidding. So, just an announcement, today we just added an AdWords/Pay-Per-Click compliant landing page template to LeadPages. So anyone who has that (thumbs up)… And please thank Juan Martitegui at Mindvalley.
I’m in a very privileged position because people like James and folks at Mindvalley and a number of different places come to us and say, “This is working better than anything we’ve ever seen,” and then they know the next question I’m going to ask them is, “Can I please put this in LeadPages, and can we like tweak it a little bit?” And we did that with one of James’ pages and it’s like an amazing webinar registration page.
So Juan was like, “Oh, I like modified your page,” and blah blahblah, and we got it approved by Google and AdWords, and it’s awesome, and I was like, “Awesome, can we add it?” He was like, “Yeah, you can.” So we have that now. So it’s not true that Google hates landing pages, it’s that Google hates certain kinds of landing pages.
In terms of re-targeting campaigns, I found that the re-targeting networks seem to be a lot more lenient, so they’re going to want different things than Google does, they’re going to be less stringent because you know, you’re re-targeting, so you’re like cooking traffic that’s already been on your website so you have like some level of permission.
Most of our pages are going to work fine with ReTargeter and Adroll… yeah we haven’t used Perfect Audience but I’ve heard good things about them.
Samuel: Yeah, cool, thanks.
Clay: Yeah, totally.
John: John McIntyre here. We’re all talking about opt-ins, opt-ins being the goal, but no one ever talks about, like if you get more opt-ins you’re going to be less qualified. You optimize the s**t out of the funnel, you’re going to get lots more people in there, but you’ll end up with freebie seekers and that kind of thing.
So what do you think about that? Should we be optimizing for more opt-ins, or should we be adding elements that are qualifying people out of it?
Clay: That is an excellent question. And it is something that a lot of people, intelligent marketers can debate about this for a while. And, so here’s my point of view. It costs virtually nothing to have someone else on your list. And if you can get them in, when maybe they just want a list of free resources, and nurture that lead over time, two years later they might buy.
I’ve seen this point of view that’s, you know, you should hyper-qualify people because you only want super-qualified people on your list, and I was like, “Why?” I know people are like “Yeah, we’re not letting people opt-in to our list anymore, we’re only letting people in who will pay a dollar for a report.” It’s like, why are you doing that? I see this as a relationship.
If you meet a girl at a bar and you’re, “Are you really into me, are you sure you like me, do you really want to go on a first -” It’s just kind of like, you know, get their number and flirt, and carry on the relationship, and then maybe you’ll get married. You’re not like, “Are you looking to get married in the next two weeks?”
So as long as it costs nothing to have another email address on your list, I’d say, you might as well get it, nurture a relationship over time, I have people who have been on my list for three and a half years and then they’re like, “Yeah, I just finally decided to buy because your concept was so good and I liked the free thing at the beginning and I thought, “What the heck.” And so sometimes it will take three years.
But this whole notion that we should be actively pushing people away because they’re not qualified… You know, you can add layers of qualification, like after someone opts in, then you can have on the next page, enter in your phone number, or fill out this questionnaire, and then you can segment that off into another list.
So I’d say, get the widest reach you possibly can, and you can qualify after they opt in, after you have their email address, and you can do a whole bunch of other things down the road, but personally I reject this notion that somehow, I can’t stand that someone would be on my list that’s only a freebie seeker. It doesn’t make a difference to me. I’d rather have them on the list than not.
John: So would you – if you could track the total opt-ins you could track, say, like the revenue numbers. So it’s kind of like the opt-ins is arbitrary, you could have 10 opt-ins you’re making $10,000 from, you’d have a 100 opt-ins and be making $9,000 from them.
Clay: Right. So I optimize around revenue. So I would rather have a billion dollar business where each person on my list was worth five cents, than a million dollar business where everyone on my list was worth ten dollars, you know what I mean? So I optimize around revenue only. And so that’s my approach.
John: Cool, makes sense. Cheers.
Clay: Yeah, totally. Thanks for the question. It’s an interesting thing, yeah.
David: Hey, Clay, well, the last guy kind of answered my question for me, but at one point you talked in one of your videos about directing people to a web page that was more like a storefront to help work on qualifying conversions.
David: Yes, so how are you, I mean are you still promoting that sort of philosophy, or are you moving away from that, more to just straight conversions?
Clay: Yeah. So what I like to do is I like to get people on my lists in the first place. And then after that, you can get them to go through various hoops to qualify themselves. But I only get them to go through hoops after they’re already on my list.
So what we did, was we were, when we were getting ready for the pre-sale of LeadPlayer, like a year ago, we took the people who were already on our list and we asked them, we told them we were giving something away, and they filled out an order form, that looked like an order form but at the bottom, it said it was $7 but we pre-populated the coupon code.
So it looked like it was an order page but the pre-populated coupon code that made it free, but it trained them to fill out an order form because very soon, we wanted them to fill out another order form that looked exactly like that order form but it wasn’t free. So that was targeted to people who were already on our list.
And so, I would never personally have as the very first thing that you do is to fill out this big long order form unless the value proposition is like off-the-charts huge. Which actually it is for that free WordPress plugin that we were giving away. We thought we could get away with it. No one else in our space was giving away a WordPress plugin that was producing the kind of opt-in stats that this free plugin was.
And so, you know you kind of have to like figure out what this situation is, and what your goal is at that point in your business. But that was sort of our approach, at that point.
David: Thanks, Clay.
Clay: Yeah, thank you.
Steven: Good day, Clay, how are you doing?
Stephen: My name’s Stephen. I just want to share with you… I want to say thanks, to start off with. I’ve been using LeadPages for a couple of months.
Stephen: And I’m in business with my best mate. I’m a copywriter, I do all that sort of stuff and he does all the sweeping behind me. And a couple of days ago… I feel your pain when you say, you know, you spend three weeks on building a product and then something that takes five minutes just cleans up.
So I did this landing page optimizer, you know, get my free blah blahblah, all that sort of stuff, with the countdown timer, it was one of your latest ones, and I converted that at 25%, OK? Now my mate, listen to this, he worked at it and it didn’t work on mobile and for some reason I thought it did. Anyway.
Clay: Which one is this?
Stephen: It’s the one with the…I’ll show you. While I’m talking, I’ll show you. But anyway…
Clay: About 75% of our templates are mobile-responsive right now.
Steven: I thought it was. Anyway, so he just does the – and I’ll show you the next page – I’m here in Sydney, I’m busy… (turns tablet to face Clay) that’s the one there. Converted at 25%, he reckoned it didn’t work on his mobile.
Stephen: Right, anyway. So he does the simple, crappy, like he can’t do, you know, yoyoyo, he doesn’t do the grammars s**t. And he said, I’m going to put out this landing page, and I said, hmm, go for it, you know? And his converts within a couple of days, mine’s been up for a few weeks, his converts at 70.89%…
Clay: Holy crap.
Stephen: And it’s… to me, I thought, it’s just “Register.” It’s just email list registration.
Clay: I’m so glad it was also a LeadPage.
Stephen: Oh yeah, it’s LeadPages. That’s why I’m up here. That’s why I’m saying thanks. And all it says is “Don’t miss out on our huge announcement. Enter your email address below to get the latest updates. Enter a valid email here. Register.”
And I’m thinking, “Yeah, whatever,” you know, give it a go, and mine’s all, “Get my free report, blah blahblah,” so, yeah. I feel your pain and thanks, for the 70.89%.
Clay: Awesome. Awesome. Oh, I always love the validation. Thank you. Alright, well thank you everyone.
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